WTF are the leftards pissing and moaning about? This is all totally common sense stuff. Surely they aren't stupid enough to believe a pull-out date is in our best interest? Oh yeah, I guess they are.

JebTexasLHB@netscape.net

It puts them on record of either suporting or not supporting the troops.
They are too cowardly to want that on the record.
They especially cannot stand para.7, since they have already declared defeat.

It is obviously a principled protest against the overuse of the word "whereas", which will propel the Democrats to a decisive victory in the 2006 elections.

Or it could just be that it undercuts their theme of our military being nothing but torturing, blood-thirsty murderers

One of those two, definitely.

Read it and see if you can deduce what the heck clause is causing the mass Democratic outbreak of weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth; danged if I can figure it out.

Did you forget your sarcasm tag?

Seriously, the problem for the Dems isn't any particular clause but the horrifying and pants-filling prospect of a roll call vote on a resolution specifying their position, in context and in totality, on the GWOT.

But I'm sure you already deduced that...

...and then there's Sen. John Kerry(Dimwit-MA):

Kerry and other Democrats accused Republicans of political gamesmanship, and promised an authentic debate next week.

What is the matter with this fool?

This is all about framing. They want to be able to criticisize everything about the war. To be able to call the troops cold blooded murderers for a defeated nation, etc. ad nauseum. But they don't want anyone to doubt their patriotism or integrity.
This resolution is amark in the sand. And since a majority of the dems in the House voted to stay on the poltroon side of the line, I think we can say that the dems are most unhappy about how this framing went.

Don't the Dems realize that this resolution could end the war in Iraq sooner? Especially if it received overwhelming support by congress?

From a military strategy point of view this is exactly what you want to do right now. When the enemy gets a major defeat (Zarq now roting in hell), increase the pressure on all fronts - more raids, appoint an Iraqi defense minister, put troops in Baghdad, resolve never to quit. Beat the drum and let the enemy cower and flee.

Why do basketball coaches often call an immediate time out after the opposing team makes a spectacular play? Sure it is to to restrategize, but it is also to break the momentum of the game.

Weirdly it is the Dems who are desperately signalling the ref. that we need a time out right now, for debate and discussion. Fools.

Kerry wanted to reword #3 ("declares that it is not in the national security interest of the United States to set an arbitrary date for the withdrawal or redeployment of United States Armed Forces from Iraq;") in such a way that it could be read as saying "we're leaving very soon", or alternatively it could be read as "we want to leave but we're not going to unless the job is finished".

His issue came down to his inability to craft a written sentence that could be reasonably understood both ways simultaneously. As soon as he figures it out, the Congress can have a "real debate".

I hope to God that any pissy conservative out there thinking about staying home in November because of earmarks or amnesty or whatever, will remember that if the GOP loses the House these Democrats and with them people like monkyboy here will be in control of the Congress.

monkyboy;

Saddam is not dead yet. The Democrats could always have their own resolution stating that they believe Saddam and the Baathists should be put back in control of Iraq and allowed to kill and maim and starve the people of Iraq and fund terrorism to their heart's content. If they really want that then should jump right in there and demand it.

Linked from 149 Democrats Vote Against Staying The Course In Iraq

monkyboy:

Well you know what? If Bill Clinton had spent as much time in his second term dealing with these issues as he did with his pants down around his ankles we would not be having a lot of these discussions. For instance you can trace Chalibi back to the Clinton years, they funded him.

But the thing that pisses me off is that for years I have listened to self righteous sanctimonious little liberals bitch and moan and whine about the US pnadering to and tolerating dictators. We liberate Iraq exactly the way Bill Clinton said we should, we bring democracy to Iraq exactly the way Clinton said we should in the Iraq Liberation Act, we go after the weapons that Clinton swore were there and now all of a sudden the same lefties who insisted we bomb the hell out of Yugoslavia become outraged that we deposed the Butcher of Baghdad.

12 million voted in Iraq, Democrats claim every vote counts, I guess that does not apply to Arabs.

BTW, 20,000 Americans have not died in Iraq, combat deaths are not even at 2,000 yet. Overall casualty rates are at about 2,500. Not so long ago, in the 80's and 90's, our peace time casualty rates were that high.

I have had relatives serve in Iraq and they are a lot more pissed off about snarky people treating them like baby killers and trashing their mission than they are anything else.

And by the way monky boy, I meant what I said, if you want Saddam back, lobby for it. Demand the bill putting him back in power. After all the votes of those people are meaningless, none of this has accomplished anything so we can just blow them off.

Say you want to be responsible for putting a man in power who feeds old people to starving dogs. And we can pay war reparations and aplogize for the whole no fly zone thing and tell Saddam he can get back to that whole ethnic cleansing thing he was doing before the big bad Republicans spoiled all his fun.

Just tell Saddam that lots of people try to kill presidents so it is no big deal if he tried to kill Bush and after we have made sure he is all comfy in his palace and after we have run out on the people of Iraq who actually took us at our word and after we have made sure that no one will ever have any faith in our word as a nation again maybe you and your little friends will be happy.

But I doubt it.

You will just move onto the next thing to bitch about. Probably demanding we "do something" about Darfur without getting all mired in useless details about what "something" might be.

The important thing is that you posture, and preen and impress upon the rest of us how you care about people while we are warmongering Bushbots who like to kill people. Go ahead, bring back Saddam. But I would get on it if I were you, the people of Iraq have plans for the man.

As I have said in earlier posts, monkeyboy and the rest of his ilk have no concept of reality as most of us percieve it. 20,000 dead? In what alternate life was that "fact" revealed to you? It is not possible to have any meaningful discourse with these folks. They live in their own land of make-belive, and reality will never have ANY effect on them. Although they do provide comic relief from time to time. And a chance to sharpen our skinning knives. From Phil K. Dick: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, persists.

JebTexasLHB@netscape.net

JebTexas:

Actually, I think MonkeyBoy said something like "20,000 dead and wounded." That's not an exact quote, but I'm sure he was giving a total casualty figure, not a death figure.

I have no idea if that is correct. I suppose it would depend how you define wounded.

Dafydd

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